certifired_img

Books and Documents

Ijtihad, Rethinking Islam

15 - COMMENTS

  • Rational,

    If you have absolutely no data to make your point then your charge is simply a figment of your hostile imagination. There is no historical record of any Church or Synagogue having been pulled down by the Muslims although the Jews are known to keep a methodical record of their history. If you cannot find any instance mentioned in their history then it never happened.

    Abu Sufiyan who lead the Meccans in the battles against the Muslims lead the Meccans in clearing up Kaba. Why would they not remove the idols having accepted Islam? It was the most logical thing to do for them. They could have chosen to carry them away with them since exile was an option to those who had fought against the Muslims and had lost the right to live beyond the four month amnesty period..

    The Meccans had plenty of opportunity to save themselves from the final outcome but were  deaf, dumb and blind to the repeated clear warnings and of the several clear chances given to them . Read the complete account in my article in 4 parts:

    By Naseer Ahmed - 7/7/2015 1:30:15 AM



  • but who sent them to destroy the idols?
    avoiding main question. where were the worship places in the prophet time where the name of God is exalted?
    by ignoring this verses the prophet is responsible for destruction of idols and wiping out the worship places of non-Muslims.
    since there is no mention of worship places in prophetic and khilafat rashida time, there is no question of bringing data.
    it is clear that this happened under the command of the prophet who was everything to Muslims.
    if this simple verses was nat practiced, there is no chance of practicing of 'la ikraha fid deen" and "lakum deenukum valiya deen" after the prophet became stronger.
    from the time of prophet down to this time there is not a single place of worship of non-Muslims.
    following Sunna there is no freedom for non-Muslims.


    By rational mohammed yunus - 7/6/2015 8:49:23 PM



  • Rational,

    When I have to make my point, I always do so with data. Now, if you want to make your point do it with data. Do your own research. 

    The Muslims did not destroy a single idol. It was destroyed by the very people whose deity the idol represented or with their express permission.





    By Naseer Ahmed - 7/6/2015 9:45:43 AM



  • Naseer saheb
    "If you want to make a point with statistics collect your own data and make it. What disables you from collecting your own data?"
    you had been one who often came with statics. that is why i asked statics from you?
    if data was available, you had been quick to come with data.
    Islamic history is enough to testify that the prophet and his companions didn't follow the Quran?
    this verse is decorative only. lakum denukum waliya deen was only practiced when they were weak.
    indeed some verses are worth following but were they really practiced or not is the question.
    By rational mohammed yunus - 7/6/2015 8:47:37 AM



  • Naseer saheb
    is my comment addressed to common Muslims?

    who commanded hz mohammed to clean the kaaba from idols? who was stopping hz mohammed and his companions to allow synagogues and churches? I am not asking about Aal e Saud?

    Do you want to say even the prophet didn't follow the Quran? or he took extreme measures against other faiths thought Allah didn't want it from him?

    By rational mohammed yunus - 7/6/2015 8:40:40 AM



  • Rational,

    If you want to make a point with statistics collect your own data and make it. What disables you from collecting your own data?

    You have quoted me in which I clearly say that the Muslims have understood Islam in a very narrow sectarian way. How does what I say contradict with your view that the Muslims have not encouraged the building of churches and synagogues?  Why do you show such poor understanding of even what you quote? Have I said that the Muslims are faithfully implementing the letter and spirit of the Quran?


    By Naseer Ahmed - 7/6/2015 7:08:31 AM



  • "When Allah says He is Rabbul Alimeen, and also says that His name is excessively celebrated in mosques, synagogues and churches, the so called Muslims insist that Allah is only Rabbul Sunni and of their subsect alone! "

    a verse to decorate Islam.
    in fact no
    synagogues and churches were in prophet time and khilafat rashida.
    if you have some example bring it out.
    why there is no space for

    synagogues and churches in mecca and Medina?
    how many

    synagogues and churches are in SA and other arab countries? in past and present? any statics from statics man!

    By rational mohammed yunus - 7/6/2015 2:51:06 AM



  • The article is again what I too believe. By sadaf - 7/5/2015 3:09:00 PM



  • See, I damn care what Maulvis say. If they have studied Islam so have I. If they can bring out things from this reference or that reference, so can I. If they can argue their points, so can I. Beside that I have been reading much more of things to be able to relate all that Islamic scriptures say. And Fatwa to kisi ke baap ka bhi hoga, to I damn care. I have my own Fatwas for them. If they can push me by force, I too can wage Jihad on them for my survival and my understanding of my Islamic duty to repel the aggression. Having said this, my considered Fatwa about 'Kafir' and 'Kafirun' terminology that has been used in scripture and in these writings, is that it is about criminals who commit crime against another human primarily and against God by not acknowledging His existence or not being thankful in their heart about the life that they have been given which they love so much that they don't want to die when in their normal happy self. The terminology in future translation of Quran needs to be translated as criminals. And of course worshipping anyone else other than God/Allah is not a crime against human. It can only be against the God/ Allah, God and Allah being the same; in fact there can be 100 names. (You call rose by any name, its fragrance remains the same.) And for the crime against God, God need no wakeel, no darogha to take actions against the culprit. In fact would God be interested in taking action that too we cant be definite. Got does and should enjoy autonomy. As far as crime against humans are concerned, even the most modern and liberal world agrees that criminals need to restained by ways and means. If need be to fight with them, then be it. If need be to harsh with them then be it. If all that much harshness is not needed then too it is Ok. God is also there to see and take action here or in the Hereafter for what that criminal deserves. As for polytheists, the word Mushrikeen is there, it is all in that God's hands to see why some people are not sure about His uniqueness and singularity and what all they deserve for it. It is none of any Muslim's business except to share with them gracefully their belief in a God, all powerful, and eternal. Sarwasarwa; Supreme. Being Non Muslims do not make anyone a kafir and being a Muslim doesn't guarantee that one doesn't commit kufr. Non Muslims if not atheist are Mushrikeen just as many Muslims with weaker faith in Allah are and who believe unduly and excessively in many other things (wealth, arms, medicine, jhaad phook, totka/charm, amulet, stone, graves , trees, dogs, cats, monkey, parrot and hell lot of things) and people (babaji, maulvi sahab, bahubali, king, dictator, prime minister, mamaji, mausaji, chachaji, banker, doctor..and just any tom, dick and harry) to save them or do miracles for them. Being a Mushrik is also no way anybody else's business except those who think God/Allah has mandated them but are like unauthorised ticket checkers and often get beaten up for such self presumptions and deservedly so. By sadaf - 7/5/2015 2:48:00 PM



  • I was reading the article by Kashif Choudhary an Ahmadi
    As a Constitutional Kafir I Ask, Does My Religious Freedom Hurt You This Much?
    This syndrome of the Pakistanis shutting out Ahmadiya Muslims from Islam, Quran and using the name of Allah and the Indonesians shutting out the Christians from using Allah as the name of their God is an extreme form of parochialism that seems to affect only the Muslims.

    When Allah says He is Rabbul Alimeen, and also says that His name is excessively celebrated in mosques, synagogues and churches, the so called Muslims insist that Allah is only Rabbul Sunni and of their subsect alone! 

    To expect that they will share the bounties of their Quran, Prophet and Religion with the rest of the world appears to be unrealistic. What they do not realise is that they are shutting themselves out from all the bounties and will be simply caste aside as an unworthy people.


    By Naseer Ahmed - 4/9/2015 9:01:22 AM



  • Dear Shri Satbir Singh Bedi,

    In a true Islamic state, the government and governance should be truly secular. 

    There are only 3 hudood punishments which constitute the criminal law ordained in the Quran (for adultery, theft and murder).

    Muslim personal law is inapplicable to non-Muslims.

    The State is free to to frame other criminal and civil laws.

    The State is expected to be completely neutral to the faith followed by its citizens.

    I have covered this in my article:
    By Naseer Ahmed - 4/9/2015 2:25:59 AM



  • With all due respect to Naseer Ahmed Sahib, what will be the position of those who are atheists/agnostics.  Will they have a right to live in an Islamic State? By Satbir Singh Bedi - 4/9/2015 1:08:23 AM



  • Food for thought from Naseer Ahmed sb.

     It would be interesting to know what the other scholars in the forum think.

    By Ghulam Mohiyuddin - 4/9/2015 1:00:59 AM



  • GM Sb,

     The Message of the Quran is unmistakable. The dictionary meaning of the word Kufr is to cover up. Muslims have been covering up the truth all the while thinking that they were doing good. Jingoism and parochialism for some reason are acceptable evils in society and in religion. The Australians have a way of saying 'He is a b*****d alright but he is our kind of  b*****d. In religion the same tolerance is displayed for evil. It starts with "he is a kafir alright but he is our kind of kafir". This goes on until kufr becomes religious dogma.

     

    In my article The Story of the Prophetic Mission of Muhammad (pbuh) in the Qu’ran (Concluding Part) Summary  I have shown that some of the big guns of every sect say that the Prophet was fighting to end not oppression but disbelief. This is not literalism. This is changing the word of God and what a monumental lie! And every non-Muslim is a disbeliever for these people which is another big lie. Is it any wonder that “Jehad” has become such a dirty word?

    Freedom of religion and conscience is and has always been an inalienable right given by God to man. God has not permitted even the Messengers of God to trample on this right let alone ordinary mortals. (10:99) “If it had been thy Lord´s will, they would all have believed,- all who are on earth! wilt thou then (O Muhammad) compel mankind, against their will, to believe!”

    Only those who oppose God and His messengers are fought against or destroyed by an act of God.

    In every age the Muslims have to fight against Kufr. This is an age in which we have to fight against the Kufr of those who call themselves Muslim. It is for this reason that God says:

    (39:32) Who, then, doth more wrong than one who utters a lie concerning Allah, and rejects the Truth when it comes to him; is there not in Hell an abode for blasphemers?

    (33) And he who brings the Truth and he who confirms (and supports) it - such are the men who do right.

    (34) They shall have all that they wish for, in the presence of their Lord: such is the reward of those who do good:

    (35) So that Allah will turn off from them (even) the worst in their deeds and give them their reward according to the best of what they have done.

    I am only trying to bring out the truth covered under centuries of “Muslim kufr” with Allah’s help. My intent is very simply to mine for truths in the Quran and bring these out with all the evidence.


    By Naseer Ahmed - 4/9/2015 12:28:59 AM



  • Naseer Ahmed sb.'s intent and endeavors are appreciable. It would be good if such a universalist perspective finds wider acceptance. By Ghulam Mohiyuddin - 4/8/2015 3:29:46 PM